diff --git a/minutes/2019/03/06/2019-03-06-march-6-2019.pdf b/minutes/2019/03/06/2019-03-06-march-6-2019.pdf new file mode 100644 index 0000000..f0e7c15 Binary files /dev/null and b/minutes/2019/03/06/2019-03-06-march-6-2019.pdf differ diff --git a/minutes/_posts/2019-03-06-march-6-2019.md b/minutes/_posts/2019-03-06-march-6-2019.md new file mode 100644 index 0000000..95ae077 --- /dev/null +++ b/minutes/_posts/2019-03-06-march-6-2019.md @@ -0,0 +1,298 @@ +--- +layout: contact +--- + +# Minutes of the 12th meeting of the Scala Center, Q1 2019 + +Minutes are [archived](https://scala.epfl.ch/records.html) on the +Scala Center website. + +## Summary + +The following agenda was distributed to attendees: +[agenda](https://github.com/scalacenter/advisoryboard/blob/master/agendas/012-2019-q1.md). + +Rob Norris is the new community representative, replacing Lars Hupel. +(Bill Venners continues as the other community representative.) + +Scala Center activities for the past quarter focused on +Coursier, Bloop, MOOCs, documentation, Metals, mdoc, +Scala.js, SIP meetings for Scala 3, and Scala Days 2019. + +Full details on these activities are in +[Sébastien's report](../2019-03-06-march-6-2019.pdf). + +The main additional topic discussed at the meeting was the question of +allowing board members to contribute engineering effort directly +instead of funds. Sentiment on the board is generally positive; the +change in still in process with EPFL legal and with a prospective new +member. + +No new proposals were made this quarter. + +## Date, Time and Location + +The meeting took place virtually on Wednesday, March 6, 2019 at 4:30pm +(UTC). + +Minutes were taken by Seth Tisue (secretary). + +## Attendees + +Board members present: + +* James Belsey, Morgan Stanley +* Stu Hood, Twitter +* Rob Norris, community/Typelevel +* Olga Makhasoeva, 47 Degrees +* Adriaan Moors, Lightbend +* Jonathan Perry, Goldman Sachs +* Frederick Reiss, IBM +* Julien Tournay, Spotify +* Bill Venners, community/Artima + +Apologies: + +* Thomas Gawlitza, SAP + +Officers: + +* Sébastien Doeraene (director), EPFL +* Jon Pretty (chairperson), Propensive +* Martin Odersky (technical advisor), EPFL +* Seth Tisue (secretary), Lightbend + +## Proceedings + +As chairperson, Jon Pretty conducted the meeting. + +### Community representative + +The meeting began with a vote to approve the Rob Norris as the new +community representative. + +Seb explained that the nomination arose as the outcome of discussions +among "the whole Scala Center", as well as discussion at the December +meeting. Then, Rob was voted in by the board. (Jon stopped the vote +once the necessary number of votes were in.) + +After the vote, Rob joined the meeting and introduced himself. "I've +been using Scala for about ten years, and I've been involved in the +community and speaking at conferences for the last five or six +years. [...] I spend a lot of time talking to [Scala] beginners, as +well as advanced users." See separate [blog +post](https://www.scala-lang.org/blog/2019/03/18/announcing-new-community-representative.html) +for further information on Rob's background and professional +affiliations. + +### Activities + +As the Center's Executive Director, Sébastien Doeraene summarized +Scala Center activities since the last meeting. + +Most of Seb's remarks were based on his [detailed report](../2019-03-06-march-6-2019.pdf) +on the Center's recent activities. The following notes are a +supplement to Sébastien's report. + +He began by saying that the report has be redesigned to be more +integrated, an group effort. He invites feedback on the new format. + +The Coursier work (on +[SCP-020](https://github.com/scalacenter/advisoryboard/blob/master/proposals/020-sbt-transitive-dependencies-conflicts.md)) +is progressing well, but isn't complete yet. + +The main Bloop highlight is faster incremental and no-op compiles, +especially for complex builds. + +The trial of EdX as a MOOC platform began in January with the new +Programming Reactive Systems course. Results are still preliminary, +but "it looks like it's gaining as much traction as the other +courses". Firmer conclusions will be possible in a few more months. + +Metals is "not shipped yet, but almost" (but has users already, +regardless). Code completion support will be in soon, at which point +it will be "a viable alternative" IDE experience, in Seb's view. + +For Scala Days 2019, platinum sponsorships are all signed and a number +of gold sponsorships are lined up, with more coming. The conference +schedule has now been announced. 15% of tickets sold in less than +two weeks, which is very promising. + +### Financial report + +(Note that the USD/CHF exchange rate is currently very nearly 1-to-1.) + +"We got the rough results from the fourth quarter of our MOOCs for +2018... We took in CHF 96K total," but it isn't known yet exactly how +much of that money will actually come to the Scala Center. This is +"slightly lower than our usual income for the MOOCs, we're not really +sure why, but we hope that the new course will of course change the +direction." + +The board continues with eight full members, for CHF 400K/year total +income. Payroll outlay is currently only around CHF 300K, so the +Center is hiring and is actively interviewing candidates. "If you +know people who would like to work at the Scala Center, send them +my way," said Seb. + +### Community feedback + +Bill said, "I've always had a hard time getting people to tell me +what their pain points are. I'm supposed to represent the community, +but people don't complain [to me] very much. So I came up with an idea +that is actually working, which is that I give free lunch-and-learns, +where I have slides to talk about what's in Dotty and so on, and ask +about pain points." These are usually "the usual suspects". "Upgrade +is always mentioned as a pain point. Upgrading to new versions of +Scala can be hard. Upgrading is something very practical that +everyone faces. Not just from Scala 2 to Scala 3, but in general." + +Seb broadened the topic a bit to include library upgrades as well as +Scala upgrades. He mentioned that the Scala website does offer advice +for library authors on this. Rob says that library compatibility is a +frequent subject of discussion within Typelevel; Cats, for example, +has a guide on this. Could standards around this be more standardized +and publicized? The advent of TASTy may change the picture, though +broadly, Seb said, "just replace binary compatibility with TASTy +compatibility". + +On another subject, Rob emphasized "how excited everyone is about +Metals and how pleased everybody is about how it's coming along. I +ran into a lot of people who are using it and very excited about it" +and the technologies it's based on, such as Scalameta and Bloop. Seb +promised to pass that on to the team, especially Olaf and Jorge. + +### Proposals + +No proposals were received this quarter. + +### Other business + +### Contributor members + +As already mentioned at the [previous +meeting](https://scala.epfl.ch/minutes/2018/12/05/december-5-2018.html), +there is an open possibility of allowing prospective board members to +participate by contributing engineering effort directly, instead of +primarily contributing funds. Seb has been in discussions with one +prospective board member interested in this arrangement. But Seb +emphasized that this won't go forward unless the board approves. + +Seb also observed that "affiliate members" (at the lower CHF 15K +funding level, but without voting rights) have so far been rare. So +the idea is to introduce a "contributor" membership, where the member +would provide a full-time engineer or equivalent. This would be known +as a "contributor" membership. Initially this would be without voting +rights, but if the right legal arrangement can be drafted and cleared, +this could eventually lead to full membership with voting rights. + +Jon explains: "Initially, the anticipation was that we would be +getting sponsors who had sufficient financial resources to spare 50K +CHF/year to be on the board. But for some companies, it's easier to +provide a full time engineer, say a company in Poland for example, +versus a bank in London or a Silicon Valley company. So I would frame +this as accommodating forms of payment that work better for +differently sized and differently located companies." + +James asked for clarification on the timetable of eventually granting +voting rights. Seb said "right now no, the regulations don't allow +it", but the hope is to change that, it's "obvious" for "fairness". +But making the change requires clearing it first with EPFL's lawyers, +then presumably also with board members' own legal departments. + +James also asked about control: "Do they get to choose what they work +on, or are going to dictate to them what they work on?" Seb said it +would be a "common agreement". + +Of course, as Jon observes, the agreement for existing members doesn't +involve either the board dictating, or the Center dictating. The +board makes recommendations; the Center then chooses what to work on, +but can't disregard recommendations too much, if they want to keep the +board satisfied. + +Seb said that they're still drafting wording around this question. He +expects there will be "a provision that we evaluate their work, and we +if we aren't satisfied with it for two months in a row, or something +like like that, then their contributor membership is in jeopardy." + +Seb said the Center has so far identified two projects that would be +good choices for this kind of effort sharing: the Dotty IDE, and TASTy +support in Scala 2 ([SCP-018](https://github.com/scalacenter/advisoryboard/blob/master/proposals/018-converging-214-30.md)). + +Stu suggested delaying granting voting rights until after "a minimum +level of [engineer] contribution" has already been reached. Fred +suggested building in some structure around how contributor members +get invited, before the trial period begins. + +Jon asked Seb if the draft agreement could be shared with the board. +Seb said yes, but not quite yet, after it's run past EPFL legal. + +Stu also raised this question: how many contributor members does the +Center want? Two, three? Twenty, thirty? Ideal terms might depend +on this. James said a large number seems like a "management +headache". Seb agreed, and said he had been thinking perhaps five or +so as a reasonable upper limit, or perhaps even lower, such as three. +James observed, "There's no harm in capping it initially," then +revisiting. + +Rob asked what "equivalent" means in the phrase "full-time engineer or +equivalent". Must it be a single person full time, or could it be "40 +hours gathered from consultants who don't have anything else to do +that week"? Because "it's much more expensive" to actually hire +someone, but also he didn't think that a patchwork of consultants +would be nearly as useful as a dedicated person. Seb: "We want to +have some flexibility" for engineers to be reassigned, but said he'd +think about how much flexibility would be too much, as he completes +drafting the terms. + +Seth asked about contributing less than a full-time engineer, is that +possible? Jon asked a different form of this question: could +it still qualify as a full-time equivalent, if the enginner in +question was considered especially valuable? Seb was skeptical this +could be "formalized". + +### Scala at Twitter + +Stu said that Eugene Burmako's departure from Twitter has some people +wondering about the status of Scala at Twitter. Internal discussion +about this included questions about Scala 3, JDK 11, Scalameta, and +rsc (the "Reasonable Scala Compiler" project Eugene led). + +Some excerpts of Stu's remarks on this: + +* "We are continuing approximately as already planned in the + absence of Eugene." +* "Rsc is unlikely to remain a full compiler. We have another + use case for the Rsc work, and we'll be talking more publicly + about those plans soon. I hope to bring a proposal to the next + meeting to attempt to get some Scala Center involvement there." +* "We don't think we are drastically behind on moving to Scala 3, or + on any Scala version upgrade. Upgrading can take a long time + (several years) in 'wall clock time', but for example the + person-time total for moving to 2.12 has only been about 6 months of + one person's time . Many other companies are still moving from 2.11 + to 2.12." + +To put this in context, Stu confirmed that Twitter has about 10 +million lines of Scala code. He also said that the biggest delays in +Scala version upgrades have been caused by Spark and other third party +dependencies. So, backwards compatibility for Scala continues to be a +major concern for Twitter. + +Since Spark was mentioned, Martin spoke up to say that "Spark is +already running on Dotty, since Dotty is more forgiving than the Scala +2 series about binary compatibility. Hopefully the problem with +external dependencies will be a lot less [on Scala 3] than it is +currently." + +## Conclusion + +Jon said that the next meeting will be held in-person at Scala Days in +Lausanne, Switzerland in June. Members not able to attend in-person +may still attend virtually. + +The tentative date and time is June 11, in the afternoon, before +Martin's keynote. Timing this to be workable for US west coast +members may not be possible. + +